Public transportation
The population of Riverside at the time of the 2000 census was around 255,000, The projected population for Murrieta is 110-140,000. The Riverside Transit Authority was started in 1975 and began operation in 1977. That being said, are there any plans for public transportation here in the land of the monster SUV? Perhaps more bus lines than the twice daily commuter link to Riverside would spare many parents from having to drive their kids to and from school each day or around town, which would in turn relax the traffic load on many of the worst intersections on Washington, the Clinton Keith overpasses at the 15 and 215, and surface streets in general. If Murrieta contracted a public transportation system or created their own, would anybody use it?
posted by J. L. Kunkle at
Friday, September 23, 2005
53 Comments:
I think it would be great! Less pollution, less congestion, less emissions...I'm all for it.
By
Anonymous, at Friday, September 23, 2005 9:45:00 AM
I'm for it too. Big multi-family development projects are coming to this town like it or not. Adams, Jefferson, and Washington are going to be home to more apartment dwellers than the entire populations of some small cities. A lot of these people will not have cars of their own. If we don't have a good, cheap public transportation system, this town is headed for some very big problems.
By
Anonymous, at Friday, September 23, 2005 9:58:00 AM
I am for it as long as it is financially self sufficient. Too much money is spent on subsidizing public transportation here in So Cal and overall use is pretty low. Sandag of San Diego has poured a high percentage of its funding into public tranportation and few people use it. The best system I have seen is the Trolley in San Diego. Maybe a light rail system would work well up here too. How about a North/ South HOV lane also. The comment by 9:58 that alot of apartment dwellers will not have cars of their own does not match reality. Most apartment dwellers have cars. Every apartment complex I have visited has cars over flowing out of the parking lots
By
Anonymous, at Friday, September 23, 2005 5:00:00 PM
5:00 If your vision of hundred of apartment dwellers with cars "flowing out of the parking lots" is supposed to make anyone feel fuzzy and warm, it fails. Sounds like a traffic nightmare to me.
But... What I want to know is whether all this apartment and condo talk is true. Are there really hundreds of apartments coming to town... in addition to all the high density units now under construction? I doubt it. I'm sorry, but it just doesn't make sense. In fact, I don't just doubt it, I can't begin to believe it.
At some point the negative posters on this blog are going to have to admit that the planning for Washington, Adams and Jefferson is the way a modern city should be planned.
People like the one above who try to paint negative images of cars pouring out of apartment parking lots are just trying to scare people and put down our city fathers, who are doing the best anyone can do to turn this town into a nice place to live.
By
Anonymous, at Friday, September 23, 2005 8:16:00 PM
Yea Rholmgren,
What are you trying to do scare people?
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Friday, September 23, 2005 8:42:00 PM
I don't know if the city core is the way a city should be planned , but from what I see it looks like it will be the highest density commercial/ retail center of town. Most of Murrieta will be free of what people on this blog call apartment hell. For the most part that would be people east of 15. The westside looks like it will have the bulk of the higher density development and that is why I think so many of the negative blog entries are coming from the westside. I was down at city hall today and spent a few minutes looking at the zoning map. All that I will say is that I am glad I do not live on the westside. I think the people who moved there should not be surprised about all the high density that is being and will be built. It has been planned for a long time. If you don't like what you see maybe you should move to another part of town. It is much easier to swim down river than up river. The only hope would be for there to be a massive change in the General Plan. At this point I think that any major change to the G.P. will lead this city down the road of lawsuit hell. I do not know if JLM would agree with me or not, but I think most property owners on the westside have every intention of developing their properties as zoned. They want to cash in . Who can blame them? It is their capitalistic Constitutional right.
Overall though this city has been planned out way better than most communities in So Cal. I have been to almost every city and many times cities look like they were developed with no plan at all.
By
Anonymous, at Friday, September 23, 2005 9:19:00 PM
9:19 - You said "lawsuit hell". Do you know who goes to "lawsuit hell"? It is people who announce to the world that they are afraid of lawyers. Once a person or a city shows the world that they collapse under legal threats, they become a bulls-eye for lawsuits. The enemy will always attack the point of least resistance. That point is usually what is called the "breach of fear". In this town, there are present and future councilmen who have announced this fear to the world.
They might as well have run a white sheet up the flagpole at city hall.
And now, the multi-family development community has begun using this weapon against the city. They will be watching closely to see how well it works.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 9:27:00 AM
There are plenty of people I know in this town who glance through this web forum. And there are plenty I know who do not. But far too few of the people I know who appreciate Councilman Kelly Seyarto ever bother to say so.
What I appreciate most about Councilman Seyarto is the fact that he brings knowledge to the Council table. He has public oriented education, and real world experience in public matters.
And he is tough. The bashing he takes from his opponents, including some on this web forum, is at times quite unfair. And yet he is able to stand tall, somehow unphased by the shots people take at him.
I appreciate Councilman Seyarto's knowledge and strength. He has helped put Murrieta on the map, and deserves a standing ovation for some of his most outstanding efforts.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 1:17:00 PM
I agree that credit should go where credit is due. 1:17 says K. Seyarto has education. On the city website it says he has a Master's in Public Administration. I assume those kind of credentials don't grow on trees, so I will join 1:17 in applauding. If you can't hear anything, it's because I'm just clapping with one hand. Because on the other hand I'm not all that impressed. Whatever the guy learned in school, he's not using it to benefit little guys in town. Yes, like me. I admit I'm trying to make a living. Not trying to make millions going on billions like Horton and the other biggies in development. Just trying to make a living like all us small developers do, just one little project at a time. I can't afford the kind of PR work major developers do. They smooze these city guys to death, and the city guys eat it up. So I will continue clapping with one hand. Try it sometime, and see what it looks like. It's kind of like swinging at a fly, or something else that is bugging you.
Been There
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 1:47:00 PM
Been There: Is "smooze" even a word? No wonder you can't get along with the people at city hall. In your cute way you try to put down another person's education and success. It sounds like sour grapes.
I like what I see, even "west of the 15" Mr. Rholmgren. I see in progress the modern, well-planned, high tax producing, best of all possible alternatives. And I see it replacing a blighted, worn out, broken down town that was already well past its prime in the 1950's.
This entire area would still be stuck in reverse if not for the forward looking team at Murrieta City Hall.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 2:25:00 PM
1:17 and 2:25,
We have been waiting for Kelly's friends (family) to join the fight. Or are you easily encouraged friends of the Van Haaster agenda. I'll bet if I asked each of you what you thought of Jack Van Haaster, if you aren't related to him, you'd have just as glowing a compliment. Tell me exactly what Kelly has done for the Council in the last few months as before that he was just one of the three votes that held a stranglehold on this city, selling us out to developers. Come back in 5 years when every inch of property is built on. When Saturday's are such a nightmare that we have to go to Best Buys, Home Depots and Wal Marts in other towns because there is no parking here. Tell me when it takes you ten minutes to go one each mile at rush hour. In the newer sections, where do your kids go to play ball.....on what ball fields......or do they have to join little league to do that? I would love to see a list of accomplishments that Kelly's education has solely beneifted in this town. Why do you think so many don't appreciate Mr. Seyarto? I don't think for the most part we know him personally unless it's through his arrogance talking on the City Council. We don't hate this man, we hate that he has sold us out. It's all about money and what developers can get. It's not about our kids and the parks. Its not about overcrowding in the schools. You must not care about those things.
But thanks Kelly for using your education to get Developers to now hold us hostage and start suing us when we turn down there projects. This is what I see his ecucation doing. Unless you count his vote against a pay raise to prove a point. Or his request to spend money on a PR firm and then he gets on here and says that the Mayor is doing illegal and unethical things because he doesn't have the right license plates.
Now both of you go kiss your husband and you Dad goodbye because he has to get to the fire station.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 2:54:00 PM
1:17 and 2:25,
We have been waiting for Kelly's friends (family) to join the fight. Or are you easily encouraged friends of the Van Haaster agenda. I'll bet if I asked each of you what you thought of Jack Van Haaster, if you aren't related to him, you'd have just as glowing a compliment. Tell me exactly what Kelly has done for the Council in the last few months as before that he was just one of the three votes that held a stranglehold on this city, selling us out to developers. Come back in 5 years when every inch of property is built on. When Saturday's are such a nightmare that we have to go to Best Buys, Home Depots and Wal Marts in other towns because there is no parking here. Tell me when it takes you ten minutes to go one each mile at rush hour. In the newer sections, where do your kids go to play ball.....on what ball fields......or do they have to join little league to do that? I would love to see a list of accomplishments that Kelly's education has solely beneifted in this town. Why do you think so many don't appreciate Mr. Seyarto? I don't think for the most part we know him personally unless it's through his arrogance talking on the City Council. We don't hate this man, we hate that he has sold us out. It's all about money and what developers can get. It's not about our kids and the parks. Its not about overcrowding in the schools. You must not care about those things.
But thanks Kelly for using your education to get Developers to now hold us hostage and start suing us when we turn down there projects. This is what I see his ecucation doing. Unless you count his vote against a pay raise to prove a point. Or his request to spend money on a PR firm and then he gets on here and says that the Mayor is doing illegal and unethical things because he doesn't have the right license plates.
Now both of you go kiss your husband and you Dad goodbye because he has to get to the fire station.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 2:55:00 PM
2:25 and 1:17 : "THANK YOU BOTH"
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 3:07:00 PM
Dear Jeff,
This is a very open minded town. That is why you have become a welcome member of our community.
.But it would be nice if you could be open minded in return.
Are you able to recognize the good done for this community by Jack vanHaaster and Kelly Seyarto (among certain others, past and present)?
If you are not too closed minded, maybe you could let us know some of the things you appreciate about the people you oppose. That would show the people in this town that you have the ability to be fair, and that you have the mental gift that is required for fine perspective.
Thankyou,
A Neighbor in Town
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 3:15:00 PM
3:15 it would absolutely amaze me if Jeff or Ed or M.E. actually did say something good about Murrieta. Their glass is half empty approach is uninspiring and unappreciative. Sometimes I wonder why people like that even bother staying in Murrieta.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 4:40:00 PM
Sometimes I read this blog and am amazed by the sad comments.
This is a bright and beautiful town. We live in the most prosperous growing area of the richest state in America, and America is the most blessed country on earth. We have it all. We have a highly professional first class system of local government, a freeway system that allows us quick access to all of Southern California, a climate washed by breezes off an ocean just twenty miles to our west, and an economy that would burst the speakers if it boomed any more than it is booming.
Whether you live in Wildomar, Murrieta or Temecula, does anyone even comprehend the miracle of what we have here?
I love Murrieta. I LOVE Murrieta. I LOVE THIS TOWN, and it breaks my heart into pieces to hear people complain.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 5:03:00 PM
AMEN 5:03 For every one thing there is to complain about there are 10 things to be grateful for. I love this ciy also and I liked where it was heading until RM brought its cancerous form of politics to town. Hopefully with some surgery and Chemotherapy we can remove the cancer of negativity and pessimism that RM and it groupies have brought to our fine city.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 5:13:00 PM
3:15 and 4:40 or Kelly and Rholmgren,
I moved to this town 7 years ago and have had two homes and actually rent an apartment for my son also.
I love this town. I love it enough to want it better and don't want to settle.
Councilmen are surrounded by planners and managers and inspectors who recommend the things we see happen in this town. The Councilmen deals on a higher level but not here. They are the ones pushing agendas. They are pushing the development as if we are racing to get somewhere, to fill every inch with housing or retail. If you are blind to that or Seyarto and Van Haaster are friends, then you have the right to talk them up and vote for them. Please do. You are asking me to tell you what great guys they are, but I don't see you detailing the wonderful things they have done, nor what they have done that any Councilmen in every city does on a regular basis. What have they done above and beyond??? You tell me. I know that Councilmen in every city don't negotiate with the planning commission of their cities to make deals that benefit them personally. I know that other Councilmen don't tell the residents to shut up and take their word as gospel putting us at risk. When you are a councilmen the city comes before your dedication to a friend. Not here. I know that I have listened to many residents question things that were taking place and were ignored or rudely dismissed. I see another Councilmen promoting developers. I see developers spending half a million dollars on three Councilmen to keep the money flowing into their pockets. I see traffic issues and overcrowded schools. I see one Councilmen recalled because he tried to cheat this city. But you must not have seen that. I saw two others named to be recalled and a large part of this community almost replaced them with trainees. What does that say to you? Recalls are not easy to promote and make happen but a very small group, got the word out and there was alot of open ears and disgusted people, that voted and actually got one of the members out. So what does that mean?
They didn't get things done alone in this community. There is a Council of five not three. But during Van Haaster's run it was a council of three as they voted as a bloc and they voted with developers on every issue, not some...every issue.
So do I credit them with some good. As a council yes. Individually NO. Unless you can tell me what they did on an individual basis that overrides arrogance and greed. That overrides the power that they crave. Sorry.
My sub-division has homes that have been in the building construction stage for almost 22 months and the fronts of the homes are still dug up. No grass. Only dust blowing down the street, covering my cars and I can't open my windows or my home is covered with dust. I have written since last February and asked that something be done. The homes are in little better shape as I write and all summer I had to have my air conditioning on. Who pays my bill? Who gave a damn?
We have pot holes all through the Police Station area that haven't been addressed and most of the time they are covered with running water. We live in the desert. There are no streams that are overrunning with rain. I watch the old town area take months and months to build a two lane improvement. These things don't take this long.
So I challange you. Tell me what personal things, not the five member council things, but personal things that Seyarto and Van Haaster have done. Lets see if they override trying to cheat us for personal gain.
If you are blind to the above and want to still cheer on Seyarto or have Jackie run again, please keep talking. Because the more you challange my love for this town the more public my comments get and the less likely your friends or relatives have a chance at being voted back in. Seyarto was ....this close...to being voted out. Lets see what happens next time and only time will tell.
If you don't think thats its unethical for a developer association to contribute 25 times more then all the other candiates combined to keep a voting bloc that voted for them on every issue, then I have nothing to reason with you on. But trust me, my voice and resources will be heard on election day. Because I want the best for this city and it's residents and I have not one thing personally at stake. I have no friends in the public arena and all I gain is to challange what I find wrong.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 5:27:00 PM
5:03... I'm not a doctor, but I play one on TV. I'd like to suggest if your emotional disturbance continues to ask your personal physician about valium.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 5:34:00 PM
Rholmgren,
All you do is challenge people but I have never heard you say one thing about your time and effort contributing to this town. I will put my money where my mouth is however. You issued a challenge. I will contribute to the new foundation and not through my business but anonymously so I don't benefit from a tax break. I will come on here and ask you to contribute not money but time, working for this foundation freely at say $20 per hour of the value of my contribution. Now we will see how much you contribute to our wonderful city.
Maybe it's the same amount that you have given to the military of our great country...nothing. Lets see. When you give 10% of the effort I have for my community and my country, you can come and talk to me. Until then, call Kelly and ask for more talking points and keep placing posts under anon. It's funny we have gotten all these wonderful people contributing when for months they said nothing, all at the same time....uummmmmmm. And not one response from Kelly.....ummmmmm. TWO PLUS TWO EQUALS......
Still havent heard from any of you people that love Van Haaster and Seyarto, say anything about asking all the Councilmen to ask that any Corporate contributions be donated directly into this new foundation??? You all love this city so much and want the best for it, wouldn't that be something that went a really long way into the improvement of this city??? Or would you rather they spend the money on signs and fliers that litter our city. Lets see where your consciences are?
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 5:44:00 PM
What 5:03 wants is that we accept whatever we get. We have a chance to do this the best we can. Why settle?? Why settle and let developers do a poor job when we should get the best? I think we all love this town or we wouldnt live here.
I guess you should just sit back and let some of us fight to make it better and better and get the best. Guess what, you can only reap the benefit of challenging these guys.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 5:47:00 PM
5:34 - Hey, Lefty, do people like you foam at the mouth as you attack decent folk?
Jeff - Your long drawn out monologues are so long that they are tedious. 99% of those who log on don't even bother reading your novels any more. The just scroll down (way down) the page to the "Jeff" signature, and move on to the next post. Only the most radical of the Murrieta hate group actually read the stuff you dish out, and even at that they probably do it through glazed eyeballs.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 5:56:00 PM
This is a good forum of discussion, and it is a hopeful sign that some of the more gentle natured people of the community make a comment in these strings once in a while.
I also think that sometimes we are seeing the comments of some of the younger community members being represented in the posts.
It is not necessary for anyone to counter such people with mean spirited responses. Our political views do not need to make us less than decent human being in expressing those views.
If someone is happy about something, maybe we can learn something from them. The cynical side of things is not all that exists.
Let us strive to be kind to one another, even if our disagreements run deep.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 6:52:00 PM
Hold your horses, 5:56. I'm not in any "Murrieta hate group", and my eyeballs are most assuredly not "glazed". And, I happen to be one of many readers who enjoy following the path of thought Jeff (and Rholmgren for that matter) present in this website. I have no problem with your own decision to pass posts by, but please don't make blanket statements about people who have a different way of thinking.
By
Anonymous, at Saturday, September 24, 2005 8:46:00 PM
5:56,
My long drawn out monologues are not for your eyes. Please continue to scroll down. They are for the reasonable people who's minds I'm changing as to the direction I believe this community needs to go. People with the "love it or leave it attitudes " died in the 70's after we left Vietnam. Just remember, each day one more person will hear my voice and maybe they too will reject the developers "boys".
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Sunday, September 25, 2005 7:44:00 AM
Bravo Jeff. Don't let the negative minded jerks get you down.
By
Anonymous, at Sunday, September 25, 2005 9:16:00 AM
Hey Jeff I read your posts most of the time even though I disagree with you. Who cares what that poster thinks? ( That person probably does read your posts Jeff but that was the only way he/she could think of to criticize you.) I drove through Pacific Oaks last week and went up through that last phase you are always talking about. I saw alot of busy work going on but I also do not understand what is taking so long. Did they have any defect issues? I see that the models are for sale and that is always a good sign that almost everything else has sold. Your complaints about dust are common in new housing tracts. Over the past couple of weeks I have sent tons of dust up in the air grading and digging footings for a 130' long 6' high retaining wall. My neighbors returned the favor by grading their yards for patios and side walks. Next month another neighbor across the street is putting in a pool. More dust. It does not matter whether we are impoving a city or residence; there is always an inconvenience price to pay.
By
Anonymous, at Sunday, September 25, 2005 10:30:00 AM
Within the next year 3 seats will be open for election on the Murrieta City council.
Mr. Seyarto and Mr. vanHaaster have stated that they have served their fellow citizens at great cost to their personal life and have no desire for continued civic service, so please lets not dwell upon past history for a moment.
By far, there are two who frequent this site who are the most vocal and opinionated persons.
Mr. Jeff, and Mr. Rholmgren, as you offer divergent views, it would be helpful if you would express the character traits you would most prefer to see in the three who would be elected next year and if you would, name persons who you think would best represent our city.
Would either of you consider donating a few years of your life to represent your fellow citizens and address the many needs of our community?; recognizing that elections now cost a considerable sum, and assuming you could finance this effort, hopefully without resorting to outside funding.
It would be helpful if you would express what you would like to see accomplished in our city in the years to come and how to financially achieve your goals.
Lets begin the new era.
Thank you.
By
Anonymous, at Sunday, September 25, 2005 11:48:00 AM
Kelly,
When someone is on the City Council for many years I have no doubt that they would contibute to some of the good things in this community. There will be goods and bads. This becomes tainted when someone does things for personal gain or for the gains of outside interests over the profit of the residents of this great city. In the same regard your incomplete statements and attacks on the present Mayor who has also contributed good and bad in the same way are tainted. WE has done as much good as Van Haaster.
What you tend to miss in Van Haaster accomplishments are the bad things the more and more he became deeply involved with the developers and the hunger for more power. Should we talk about the failed annexation of Wildomar?
Now Richard Nixon was probably one of our better Presidents when it came to foreign policy especially with regards to China, however when someone does things that are unethical or for personal gains then they are held accountable for the bad. You talk like old Jackie's daughter was not out for a profit in her child care center but just interested in getting our children off the streets. What he did was for sole benefit to his families business. It could have been done outwardly instead of hidden in back rooms. It was for profit, unless Jack and his daughter are donating their time and profits from this center.
You talk as if no one had anything to do with these other areas aquiring land with improvements in mind.
What I have basically challenged is the constant cooperation with developers to the detriment of our city. Never getting everything we deserve from these big businesses. We have let them off the hook each time. We now have two councilmen that support the lawsuits and have given the power back to the developers. If you don't like the decision by our council and you are a developer....just sue. The two councilmen will always vote with you.
Kelly in summation, people in this town answered all of your compliments of Van Haaster by voting him out by recall. They couldn't wait through the normal election process. That is for his failures to communicate, his arrogance when challenged. His unethical quest for power and for personal gain. We as residents cannot catch a person doing closed door deals. But when they have the motivation of working the system in one way, then I am quite sure we the residents felt by the appearance of his voting bloc that it was being done on a regular basis. These are not attacks. They are facts. He was recalled. You come under the same scurtiny. I am just calling it like I see it. Do I think that Kelly has done nothing for this community? No, I don't think that. But when a politician becomes too big for his shoes, he needs to be cut off. You were served notice. You, through your posts, have not come down from your high horse. You continue to push the Van Haaster agenda through your last post. This is the agenda that draws you closer and closer to Van Haaster's unethical behavior. You would like nothing better then to continue to belittle everything that Enochs and Ostling and Gibbs do and boast about what the former Council did. I'm glad you pushed the Santa Claus thing, but what I would have liked better is one ball field within walking or bike riding distance of some of our homes. Instead of letting these developers build on every inch. Lets poll some of the residents and find out if they think we need more parks. Better planning and less pocket change for these developers would have been the answer. But, that isn't part of your agenda. What is part of it is to belittle all on the current council minus you and McAlister and bring back jack. There I gave you your new propaganda slogan..."Bring back Jack". What you forget is that you too are a signature, like it or not, on each success or failure of this City Council. We remember each dealing, good and bad. Instead of bring back jack your slogan should be to bring us more parks, less traffic and more added value.
Enochs will get what he deserves too. He is not on here and his attacks on you have forums that we don't always see. All we see is you attacking and the developers profiting.
The people who contribute to your benefit on here, are blinded by something. I already stated that you have done some good, it would be foolish to not state that. It's the extreme arrogance and connections to developers that we WON'T tolerate anymore.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Monday, September 26, 2005 7:08:00 AM
Jeff the more you post the more I think that you really do not bother to get out much. You say you wanted a ballfield within walking or biking distance of your house. You live in Pacific Oaks. I have walked and mountain biked over this entire area for years. You want parks? There is one near the freeway by your house. There is a larger and beautifully landscaped park at the corner of Nutmeg and Jackson. Within a few hundred yards and North up Numeg there is another park with a playground and a wonderfully large soccer field. (My daughter and I love to practice her softball there). If you go off of Nutmeg and down Mountain Pride there is a large park with, would you believe it Jeff, BALLFIELDS! All of this is so close to your house that you could be at any of these with a FIVE MINUTE BIKE RIDE. And of course Jeff if you feel like riding another five or ten minutes you can reach Cal Oaks Sports park. Jeff maybe you are indoors too much on the computer. There is no other way I can explain the disconnect between your statements and reality.
11:48 anyone who serves in the future will need the free time it takes to devote to council service. We do not need more W.E.'s in office who accomplish little for the city outside of council meetings. I would be nice to see some new faces on the ballot. I am kind of tired seeing people like N.K. run on the same worthless rcycled platform. I would vote for someone only if they are not endorsed by R.M. or any of their supporters. I want someone who can make impartial objective decisions and not be swayed by the knee jerk emotionalism that RMers bring to the political table. I want someone who is maybe retired and has a broadbased background. Also the last person I want to see on the ballot is Ed Faunce. I am tired of the truth being distorted.
By
Anonymous, at Monday, September 26, 2005 10:35:00 AM
Jeff: Jack over the years accummilated 100 pounds of positive accomplishments and the Rmers tore him down with the one pound daycare issue. Vanhaster has more community accomplishments hanging off his pinky than Enochs, Ostling, or Faunce combined. The little three only have bitterness and negativity working for them and absolutely NO foresight. If the little three had been in charge for the last 15 years our city would look like a poor cousin to Wildomar.
By
Anonymous, at Monday, September 26, 2005 5:12:00 PM
Seems I got you hot under the collar Kelly. Well good!! The more I talk maybe the more you will realize that all the Developer money in the world can't shout us down. All the "you don't know what youre talking abouts", will not stop us from talking.
OK....first off, you are right that I don't know everything that goes on. I'm not paid to know it, you are. I do know things I see and things that are basically common sense.
Things I see. This council is not a cohesive group that works together for the common good of the community. If you worked for me, I'd fire all of you and start with people who had our best interests at heart, not bickering, not revenge and not arrogance as their agenda. Thats what we have today. If you want to ask me an example Kelly, read your posts and you will see it clear as day.
I see traffic problems and poor construction planning. Examples are starting with "old town" and the streets surrounding the new police station. Traffic problems all along Jefferson at evening rush hour just as a start.
I live in a complex that the developer has left incomplete because he can't sell the homes for almost two years when the first framig was started. Who is the fault here? Two years Kelly of a chain link fence blocking the street and homes half built.
I don't have any "guys" on the council. I don't support any of you right now. If it was ethical or lawful, I'd pay our councilmen $150,000 per year each. I'd make them answerable to the community. I'd ask for written reasons from each member to justify their votes. I'd make sure they developed teams among themselves for these projects you take sole credit along with Van Haaster for, with approvals of suggestions by the teams, making contributions equal. You are a business that works like the guys at 7-11. No, maybe they work better as a team.
I don't have enough history here knowing what each councilmen has done, I wish I did. So to ask me what you have done beyond the recall days, I can't answer that. But what I can do is tell you what I feel as a homeowner for almost 35 years. That is MY JOB. I have a history in 6 different homes and with 6 different city councils and none are like this. They work closely together. And I lived in Chicago where all the alderman are crooks.
So to answer what my guys have done, I'll pass. My guys are not council members yet, or are hidden among you and havent had the guts to stand up and say these things that I'm saying now.
You answered one of your own questions and I quote. " The preschool issue is the only questionable thing that gave his (speaking of Van Haaster) political enemies a shot at him." One unethical question mark, with him apologizing is enough to rid this community of his cancer. One unethical fault is just the surface for problems like this. It's the only one he got caught committing. Your a conservative. You treat crimminals the same way. You expect that they have not committed only one offense and you also predict that they will commit more in the future. Well in politics the same pattern occurs.
As for other issues during Jack's kingship I have to work off experience and that is that we had a divisive council while he was Mayor and possibly long before that. I have repeatedly commented on the 500K contribution to keep you and he in office by the development community. They don't do that because you cook at their cook outs, or maybe you do. They do it because they knew they could profit off you being in office. Period!!
As for parks, you should know exactly how many. But in Pacific Oaks, if I had a 8 year old boy who wanted to play ball, it's a mile walk crossing two busy streets. Not like the old days where Dad could yell out the door to come home. Kelly I don't care what you raise my taxes to, so you can pay for better things in this community. I would pay for a state of the art hospital, larger and more parks, a reserve sanctuary that would attract people to our retail businesses and restaurants. Have you driven through our "old town", Do you think people are flocking to come to Joannies for dinner? They would come if we provided them a place to come. I think you should ask the residents what they want and what they would pay for instead of just selling us out to apartment complexes and housing developements. Just ask Kelly.
I have never talked to Ed and if you read my posts, they were long before Ed began posting on here. No, I'm not someone who lets others talk for me. I am speaking my mind and my feelings which is my right and my community duty. You however have a higher duty.
In closing, Kelly, I don't think anyone that has committed or has walked the thin line between unethical behavior deserves my trust and that of my neighbors. I don't think it's OK to do some good things and then one bad thing and believe in my heart that it was OK to do. Thats not my ethics but maybe its yours.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Monday, September 26, 2005 6:07:00 PM
Rholmgren,
Are you the Kelly's protective bodyguard? If you think that no one else could do the things they have done as councilmen you have never owned a home in other communities. Many people do good things as Councilmen. Many do poor things. It seems we have had a few that were capable of some very good things but let Big Business and personal profit lead them down another path to some of both the good and bad.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Monday, September 26, 2005 6:11:00 PM
Kelly,
On your last comment you are either misinformed or misleading. I have lived across from these new homes for three + years. The flood control basin was re-developed the first year. And yes I understood the dirt and dust from the earthmovers. That was 2003. They laid the pads for the houses that year and began framing. The last homes began framimg in Feb. of 2004. So that makes it 21 months since they started framing the last homes. How many homes have you seen that take 21 months to build. My home took 6 months. So your information is inaccurate and your statement is misleading at best.
After a statement like that, you talk about knowing things and finding out exactly the facts, yet you cannot do it and you have access to all the records. Why can you ask me to prove opinions when you cannot even state facts correctly without again supporting your developer friends. Why aren't you supporting me the resident. You aren't on here defending the person that pays your salary with his tax dollars. You are defending the developer and his problems. Thats the reason I am on here talkling about you. But maybe it isn't me paying your salary with my taxes, maybe your salary comes from somewhere else.
You again go off that I said that you and Jack and little Mac have done nothing. You better read the above posts I have made. I said you had done good things. I said that doing ten good things and then doing something bad does not win my support. It doesn't equal out. So again, you talk around my statements instead of addressing them. You want to lead me down a different path, thus my long drawn out comments and repetitive comments. I keep repeating asking for answers.
Would you vote for someone who had done ten good things in his political life but then done an unethical thing that he apologized for only after he was caught doing it? He didn't come forward and say....opps sorry. From what I saw, you were the one covering it up by telling the crowd that you vouched for him. Was I misinformed? No, I was sitting there listening.
Developers didn't pay enough in my sub-division. They didn't build one park. I have already stated the condition of the homes. They have done minimal improvements if any, except pack as many homes into an area as possible, and the streets are so small that sometimes when driving past another car they cannot pass each other if there are parked cars on both sides. That is one example. And given that one example, you will now come back in defense of the developer, so why waste my time. I have been addressing this issue of homes with you since before the recall vote and what has been done. Nothing. Good job in raising this issue. Maybe you stopped in that office for a cup of coffee but not to research the facts. But I guess all developers are more honest then the average resident to you.
So I answered about Jack and his deeds. 10 good do not right one wrong.
You answered my question all through your posts over the last few months about our council working as a team. You have more then once talked about more then WE as being part of the failure of this current council.
I have made recommendations that you have ignored. Have all the Councilmen ask the business community to give election donations directly to the newly created foundation....Kelly...no answer. I have asked, why not set up sub-committees within the council addressing different issues and MAKE the little boys play nice together. Have open hearings on the findings of these committees and make sure all Councilmen are working together and toward a harmonious goal....Kelly...no answer.
When it comes to believing you about the 500K and developers interest in keeping you on. I have already stated my reasons....over and over. I believe you as much as I believed you when you vouched for Van Haaster. That is my opinion. I base it on logic that I have explained. People can sneer at it or believe it. But again, I have seen your attitude in action. Others who have spent enough time listening at council meetings have heard it so I am not the only one with this opinion. You have stated in the last few posts that we who complain know nothing, but Kelly, I feel that you fight so hard against one resident posting these things because you are hiding from the facts. I have no proof of wrongdoing. Don't ask. I have a gut feeling. We shall see where it goes and where you end up after your days on the Council. Maybe in the direction Stone went. Maybe somewhere else. All I know is that if you don't see eye to eye with Councilmen Seyarto, he will not work with you. He will call you ignorant and uninformed. Only he knows the real truth. Now would you tell me again how you would vouch for Jack and his unethical behavior?
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Tuesday, September 27, 2005 6:53:00 AM
Kelly S - I'm one of those who think you're basically a good guy. But PLEASE --- those developer's did not donate $500,000 to "straighten out misinformation". That is an absolutely incredible statement. They were banking on what I think you will push back into their faces, and that is that you owe them something. Just in case you don't get this, I do. I've lived around these people. They DO NOT donate anything with clean motives. PERIOD. NO EXCEPTIONS.
By
Anonymous, at Tuesday, September 27, 2005 9:47:00 AM
947 is 100 percent correct. Developers donate to who they think will come through for them. They have no other reason at all to donate to anyone.
By
Anonymous, at Tuesday, September 27, 2005 10:55:00 AM
Kelly,
It seems you don't read my posts and understand. I thought I laid my development situation out clearly. They didn't have any utility problems for the last 24 months. The houses and pads were started 24 months ago. They would finish up each part of framing, and then separated by weeks sometimes months between working on these homes. Since August, they have put on garage doors and dug up the fronts to put in sprinklers. That was done 3 weeks ago. No progress since. Like I said, you are not watching day to day I am. So when you call me uninformed, you better consider yourself in that group.
You're right, I have made the fact that I believe you are in debt to developers for their contributions and you won't convince me otherwise.
Again you didnt read the part about election donations completely. I said businesses should donate especially business that have a direct connection to councilmen and the benefit decisions that you make involving them. I don't care if every citizen in the world contributes to you. It's businesses in the development world. Why didn't you read this???
Just like the other two votes state, you are misleading and or not all there if you take that "vote of confidence" as anything but a payoff for your future vote. You may fool some of the people but I can see most are not fooled. The more you say things that contradict the normal residents thinking the more votes you lose and more importantly confidence in the good things you do. But, I believe your too arrogant in your personality to care. Thats not calling you a name, just stating the attitude you have in your posts.
As for my tiraids.....if you knew my personality, you would find I'm very laid back and just enjoy trying to make this great place a better place.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Tuesday, September 27, 2005 1:33:00 PM
Jeff come on! Which Monopoly company do you run? You are looking more and more foolish over time and you are starting to state more and more JEFF FACTS that are outright distorting lies. Jeff if I asked you what color the sky was you would say red. You would then assert that all right wingers say skys are blue because our ideology will not let us see your truth. Jeff the clown analogy is more true than ever.And Jeff why didn't you bother to ask the builder or visit the city and ask about the houses in your tract? The answer: Because making ignorant false accusations are more important to you than the truth. Hey Jeff where are the parks? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAAHAH (:
By
Anonymous, at Tuesday, September 27, 2005 5:34:00 PM
Councilmen Seyarto,
First of all you have stated more then once about facts that you have learned about the Pacific Oaks subdivision. My model which is the largest on one of the largest lots was just appraised at 600,000. After just calling the sales office the highest priced home for sale is 591,000. So for one, there is not a home that has just been built in the area of $679000 unless you are speaking of the fully designed and furnished model. You keep mentioning that these were construction delays. They took one year to manipulate the site and fix the retention pond. The next two years were spent doing very little. I was here, you were not and if you check when approvals were given by the city to set the pads you would find me to be accurate. The developer played the market at our expense. The houses were not selling and decided to gamble by letting them sit. He dropped the value of my home by doing that and the homes of my neighbors. So it wasn't that these houses couldn't sell. It's that the builder was hoping prices would escalate once again. You see thats what there in business to do, make as much money as they can.
Now for the parks in my sub-division. Of the 100+ homes, Pacific Communities did not build one park. Not one, yet will walk away with millions in profits. Thats the negotiation that has been missed in my sub-division and in others. I will work on facts and figures as I get the time, but it will not be to your benefit when I do. So my question is why a developer is alllowed to build one hundred homes and is not required to build an on-site park. The kiddie park you talk of is not part of my sub-division and the kids play catch in the street as the park is too small. Every street has one of those little green men with the flag. Do you want Mom's with strollers walking half a mile, small kids crossing major streets because the council was too lazy to ask the builder for a park? You let me down here. I am disappointed and frustrated by what has happened in my sub-division and as I talk to other residents I find more of the same. Ask the residents on here if we could use more parks. I don't mean complexes like California Oaks. I also am talking about the new (3 year old or less) sub-divisions, not homes that have been here for years. Thats where you let us down. The newer development. With that said, tell me about some large parks that have been created over the last three years in these new areas? So if you add my sub-division with the other two west of Jackson we have one small kiddie park and a half court basketball court for 250 homes. Thanks a bunch. The other parks were built to service the homes built around them, at a time when it appears the city made developers cough up some added value or the city decided to not build on every square inch.
Those are not the exaggerations that you talk about just facts. 250 homes.....one kiddie park. Fact.
If you are the man you talk about being, you would announce today that all developer money headed for your re-election coffer should instead be directed into the new foundation and I call on each of the councilmen to do that. Again, ask the residents what they think.
As to working as a team, you are only a team player when you like the players. You are as divisive as anyone else, more because you publicly show it. I will repeat what your agenda is. Make Enochs, Ostling and Gibbs look like fools and Bring back Jack!! That is what your battle cry will be, but you had better watch that you bring back Kelly.
Anyone who is foolish enough to believe you and then has watched your vote go with the developers with each vote had better go back to the Kelly school of politics. You are the developers tool. Everytime they say they want something you vote for it. Yes, Im sure you throw us a bone that really doesnt cost the developers much but overall if someone dug into it, they would find that you are their puppet. Sorry to say that but I went to the school of hard knocks and have learned the hard way.
My vote is not going to be bought either. As I said before it has to be earned. Enochs is not my boy, but is playing out the season. He doesnt have my vote either. We need new blood, some new hope and new thougt. Men who have no agenda except benefiting the people who live here not the ones they think will add dollars to their tax base. Your vote is way to easily swayed by revenge and repayment Kelly. We saw that with your vote against the pay raise. You are allowed to have a vote that we expect you to use for us and you wasted it on revenge. Very sad.
Jeff
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Tuesday, September 27, 2005 6:15:00 PM
Jeff if you wanted a park so close to your home then you should have bought a house next to a park. So simple and yet I doubt if you will ever understand.
By
Anonymous, at Tuesday, September 27, 2005 7:36:00 PM
Councilman Seyarto, you have a faulty memory. I never threatened to recall anyone for their votes on the Hayes closure. You sir, are simply wrong.
I do remember saying something to the effect that if the three councilmembers, who always voted as a block, didn't start responding to the residents that we would be your worst nightmare. But there was no threat of a recall.
In fact, it was not I who first mentioned "recall." I have explained to you over and over that after you chaired the meeting on the vanHaaster day-care center and whitewashed his ethical violations, the subject of recall was born in the council parking lot.
It was not me that raised that issue. I was simply standing there listening to a long-time resident of this City who was saying to the entire group - "we have no choice except to recall members of this council." I remember thinking that he sure seemed to be right. As it turned out, he was right. In fact, he is still right. The job is not finished.
I have been very busy handling litigation matters, but I have been reading the blog when I can get to it.
I would like to say that the apartment and condo problem is much worse than even the opponents have said. Our General Plan is so far out of balance that, if anything, a moratorim should be declared on all building.
Can that be done? Of course, developers and land owners do not have a right to develope what they want when they want it. Isn't that true?
What's the matter, are you afraid of lawsuits? The California Courts have already declared that projects can be stopped when it is necessary to get a GP back into balance.
So how are hundreds of new apartments going to ease our traffic, make our schools less crowded, and put more police on the streets? Clearly, they won't. You sir are contributing to the downgrading of this City in the name of the liberal policy of social engineering to get low cost housing.
You are simply wrong and should be voted out of office at the next election. You do not represent the residents of this City. You just keep pounding the money into the pockets of your developer supporters. You say they can't buy you. But they don't have to, you are already totally committed to them. All they have to do is just keep you in office.
It would be nice if the residents had a council which fought to keep Murrieta a special community. But you, former vanHaaster and McAllister are too easily influenced by the bright lights and the billing and cooing of the Chamber and other business interests.
It is definitely time for further change and despite the enormous amount of time you give to the City, it's time for you to move on and let others who will fight for Murrieta residents take your council seat.
Edward Faunce
By
Anonymous, at Tuesday, September 27, 2005 10:46:00 PM
No Kelly I DID NOT THREATEN YOU WITH A RECALL. There, is that loud enough for you to hear.
What's this crap about calling me a "peach." You know you sound just like Hillary Clinton, "We have to do it for the Children." And by the way, social engineering is not equivalent to a "socialist agenda."
My God, you don't understand the diff between socialism and social engineering?
Why does everything have to be done "for the children?" What about the residents who are not children but live here right now?
Whenever I hear a pol doing the "for the children" bit, I know that s/he doesn't want to talk about what's going on right now. They want to postpone the discussion to some time in the future when the unidentified children will supposedly be benefited. Of course, the pol will no longer be around to be held accountable -- but neither will most of the residents who had to put up with the pols failed agenda.
No, Kelly, quit hiding behind the skirts of the children. I thought one council member doing that was enough. (Remember, vanHaaster, I'm just a doting father trying to help my daughter.)
Why can't you simply accept that you do not want to stand up to developers? You do not want to stand up to the City staff and say listen, we've got a General Plan and it must be brought into balance.
Stop bleating and crying that you're doing it for the children. We all take care of our own children. We don't depend on you do that.
When we say that the schools are too crowded, you want to increase the population.
When we say that we don't have enough parks and playgrounds, your answer to is to bring in even more dense development.
When we say that our streets cannot handle more traffic and that we can't access the 15 and 215, you simply add to the traffic.
You are a nightmare to this City, because you are so arrogant. You belittle your critics by trying to label them as "I got mine." But name calling is not an answer.
Your planning and execution resembles the deposed FEMA Director Michael Brown. You do the opposite to the needed response.
And what was the stupid crack about "good luck with my litigation, you'll get your wallet ready?"
Edward Faunce
PS You did not answer whether you agree that when a GP is out of balance, a City can call a moratorium on building. Do you know the answer? Tell us what you think the answer is, OK?
By
Anonymous, at Tuesday, September 27, 2005 11:59:00 PM
Councilman,
I too have stated that you have many more important things on your slate then to worry about where my kids will live. What would be a more important agenda, if I was setting them for the council, would be in bringing some real jobs into our community. Working at Best Buy and CompUSA while not a terrible job, is not the jobs that will keep residents from moving to...where did you say...Arizona. Instead of new apartments, why not new manufacturers?
Ed is right, we need a new council. One that is from among us. One who thinks that people who live here are more important then people who will live here in 5 or 10 years. What did they say in the movie "field of dreams". Build it and he will come. Here it's build it and THEY will come. As a Councilman you are answerable to the constituates that live here and we don't have a voice in the council. The developers do. We are going to change that.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Wednesday, September 28, 2005 7:22:00 AM
I remember hearing a quote recently from someone in charge of Hurricane relief. I think I will paraphrase it. Ed and Jeff you are both stuck on stupid and you do not know the way out.
By
Anonymous, at Wednesday, September 28, 2005 8:16:00 AM
Kelly,
To roll around in the gutter with anyone else you have to pull yourself out of the gutter with the developers......bring McAlister with you.
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Wednesday, September 28, 2005 12:44:00 PM
Kelly you said:
"And Ed, the crack about getting my wallet ready was in reference to your litigation. Usually, it seems, whenever one of your clients wins, the taxpayer's get to pay for it in the form of free money for life for the "disabled" person. Remember, I used to work with one of your clients. That guy was the poster child for what is wrong with the system. This is not to say that all claims are unjustified. But there are many that are just ridiculous and are really just a fleecing of the taxpayers. But I really think you knew what I meant now, didn't you?"
If this is an example of your ability to think, report fairly and honestly, then Murrieta is even in worse shape than I had thought.
First, I guarantee that you do not know the facts of any particular case in which you are uninvolved. Especially medical disability cases where the evidence is confidential as a matter of law and public policy.
As far as the fleecing of the taxpayers, again you are wrong. The benefits paid to disabled employees comes from a trust fund into which they have paid and their employers as well. But, and here's where you are wrong, disability retirements are for the benefit of the public employer. It is the way that the employer can transfer a disabled worker from full pay to a retired worker at reduced pay.
Instead of finding out the facts, you chose to simply villify disabled workers who are forced to give up their full time jobs and take partial pay. You prefer to pretend to understand the system or to have inside information - when it is obvious that you know very little or nothing about the subject.
However, your willingness to express an opinion on a subject which you clearly do not understand, demonstrates precisely the character flaw which has been identified repeatedly by posters to this blog. You have no humility. You think you know better than others, even those who clearly are expert in the subject matter.
That's why you a dangerous to this community. You will persist in your narcicisstic belief that you know best and then jump for a lifeboat just as the Titantic goes down.
Edward Faunce
By
Anonymous, at Wednesday, September 28, 2005 1:14:00 PM
It is possible for a person to detest Councilman Kelly's policy on the apartment/condo issue (which I do, I think it is a horrible tragedy in the making); and yet like his good qualities. I know, because I am that person.
Kelly, please think of the people who voted for you. I do not know anyone who likes what you have in mind regarding the apartment/condo matter. The ability to admit a mistake is a positive quality, and your stand on this issue is a really, really bad mistake.
A Murrieta Constituent
By
Anonymous, at Wednesday, September 28, 2005 1:28:00 PM
1:28 Wake up and smell the person you voted for. Your friend Kelly does not care about anyone's opinions except his own, and his own opinions come from the big wigs who have his ear and his heart. And maybe his mind, but there's no evidence he has a mind of his own, because he has Sacramento, Washington and an assortment of big developers to do his thinking for him. Your opinion, sad constituent of Kelly, does not mean anything at all.
By
Anonymous, at Wednesday, September 28, 2005 2:18:00 PM
A Murrieta Constituent,
I agree that Councilman Seyarto has good qualities. He has done good things. He has energy and drive.
But, it keeps coming back that if we question him or ask him to explain something then we are wrong or we hate him. He must have good qualitites because I have heard he is a good family man and has a good job. But even people that are good can be overbearing and arrogant at times and are not above the influence of power and money. None of us are perfect and all have positives. The qualitites needed to be a Councilman are humility and knowing how to handle people with a fair and just hand. If you read his posts on here, you will see when challenged he reacts totally in the opposite direction. His comments are not understanding and fairness driven but arrogant and full of revenge. If he had those other traits and still flawed I for one would be asking questions in a different manner. Kelly could do so much good but is connected so deeply to the wrong people and the wrong interests that his value here is nil. Kelly, I truly mean that and wish that when asked you had come back in your posts understanding what we the residents are feeling. If when questioned about the developers 500K donation, you had said....I understand how you feel because I would feel that way too and this is what I'm going to do to fix that immpression. But, not once did you come back with that attitude. It's always.....this is me, if you don't like it I don't care. I'm sorry, but you don't speak for most residents here in town. It's not just Kelly. We have others that need to go, because most don't have Seyarto's fire. But your fire needs to be focussed for us, not attacking us. We eventually get even because we pay the bills. The people coming down the road a year or two later don't. Why doesn't that make sense to him?
Jeff
By
Anonymous, at Wednesday, September 28, 2005 4:06:00 PM
Jeff -
Council man Seyarto has good qualities, but that same thing applies to everybody on earth. Even the worst person that has ever lived probably has some good qualities. No matter what his good qualities are he is still the most unpleasant person that has ever been on the city council.
I have off and on watched the goings on at this city council for the better part of 15 years. No one has ever been able to make bigger enemies for smaller reasons than council man Seyarto. I dont think he could possibly be such a dividing and disrupting force without trying to be. The main question is why anyone would want to be a destructive person. I dont know why, but there are such people in the world.
By
Anonymous, at Wednesday, September 28, 2005 6:03:00 PM
Why don't you political people in Murrieta stop and take a breath? Only about three percent of people in this town care about your bickering. Get out of the house. Enjoy the nice fall weather. Be nice.
By
Anonymous, at Thursday, September 29, 2005 12:40:00 PM
Sure. Healthy, for sure. Can we all back away from the trenches for a while? I don't know. This is Murrieta. But even if it turns out to be a calm before a storm, it's still maybe, as Martha says, "a good thing". Good old Martha. I bet that's what she said when she got out of jail. "It's a good thing."
By
Anonymous, at Thursday, September 29, 2005 3:34:00 PM
"Politics is supposed to be the second-oldest profession. I have come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
- Ronald Reagan
By
Anonymous, at Thursday, September 29, 2005 4:11:00 PM
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